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Messages - Ride the High Country

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1
You’ve convinced me! I have submitted an application for membership.

However, my comments above weren’t meant to advance my interests as a then-non-member. I still think that at least the forum should be usable by non-members. It would certainly bring more benefit than harm to the organisation.

Is there any way that the old Wheelmen forums can be put up as an archive?

Eric, thanks for your explanation. And Mike, thanks for your thoughtful comments.



2
Many thanks for that reply.

I suppose that another reason I have hesitated to join the Wheelmen is that I assumed that the focus of the newsletters and magazines is on high-wheel bicycles. Although I find them beautiful and elegant machines, iconic symbols of the Victorian period, I can not ride one and will thus, alas, never own one. My interest is primarily in the very early safety era.

The barrier certainly wasn’t parsimony on my part. And I certainly do see the value in the Wheelmen! I hope that I didn’t convey an impression to the contrary. I may well become a member soon, but it would not change my opinion on the matter of the proposed restrictions.

Although a number of special interest club sites do restrict some material to paying members, it is most unusual, I think, to so restrict the discussion forums, though there is occasionally a special sub-forum limited to members, where they may discuss club business in private.

I fear that restricting the Wheelmen forums would have negative consequences for the organisation, in that it would eliminate an important mechanism whereby interested parties might be drawn to become members. It would also limit the breadth of discussion, as well as the trade in antique bicycles and related items. In a sense, the proposed changes portend something of a withdrawal from the outside world.

The current Wheelmen forums are uncommonly quiet. Imagine what they would be like if non-members were barred from participation. Please think very carefully about this.

If the cost of maintaining the forums is an issue, it would be possible to add a link for donations via PayPal.

Does the original forum exist at all in storage?

3
I am not a member of the Wheelmen, in part because for various reasons I am unable to attend events. But I have read and participated on the Wheelmen forums for years.

As a non-member, my opinions of the planned changes to the web-site may not carry any weight, but I’ll state them anyway.

Ever since the old forum disappeared, the Wheelmen’s web presence has faltered. The old forum was a fount of valuable historical and technical information, much of it contributed by members who no longer participate, or who have passed away. When the current forum was initiated, it was announced that the old one would be either merged with it, or put up as an archive. Neither happened, and a rich source of data appears to be gone forever.

I think that the change, and the disappearance of years of splendid posts and discussions, was discouraging to many members, and this may be why participation on the current forum is so sparse. Much of the activity has moved to the Wheelmen FaceBook page, which is a useful venue, but not nearly as good a record as a proper forum.

When I met with Craig Allen in December of 2018 to pick up a special 1893 Featherstone Prince bicycle he had beautifully restored, we briefly discussed the new Wheelmen forum, and he called it the “Wheelmen index”. He was joking of course, but he was essentially right. A look at the threads of the forum, and the number of replies to posts, will show sadly little interaction—a mere shadow of what the original forum was like.

Now, it is proposed to make most of the Wheelmen web-site—including a new forum—accessible only to dues-paying members. This will in my opinion further marginalise the site and forum. It would bar from participation those who have much to offer, but who may not be able or willing to become paying members of the Wheelmen. It would discourage potential new members. It would prevent non-members from offering for sale items that members would want. And from my experiences with other clubs, I can say that it will not motivate people to become paying members simply to access the site or post a question or message on the forum.

A look at just the pre-1930 sub-forum of the CABE will show that there is certainly no dearth of interest in antique bicycles, and thus no reason why things should not be much more lively here.

I suggest that while the proposed changes are under consideration, some thought be given to fostering an open, welcoming web presence, with a forum that invites free participation from throughout the world.

If the original forum could be put up in archive form, so much the better.

4
That marvellous catalogue would have brought a lot of clarity to the original discussion! Here we can see that the 1893 Road Queen did in fact have steel wheels and 26-inch tyres. The fact that the wheels and tyres fit the frame far better in the catalogue cut (which was made from a photograph and was a very precise depiction of the actual bicycle) seems to indicate that the steel wheels with Dunlop tyres had a larger outer diameter than the later wood wheels and single-tube tyres.

The 1893 Featherstone mudguards were steel. The wooden mudguards currently on the Road Queen in the museum must have been added somewhat later. The rear mudguard was drilled for string lacing, whereas the bicycle was originally fitted with screen guards for the skirts, in the same style as the chain guard.

The handlebar remains somewhat mysterious. It looks similar to the original, but inverted.

Thanks for adding the photos, Brad.

5
Paul, it would be wonderful if you could somehow make the Featherstone threads, from the old Wheelmen forum, available again.

The Road Queen from the long discussion is indeed at a museum:

https://www.wheelsofthepast.org/Current-Display-by-Year.html

In the first photo on that site, it can be seen that tyres have been installed on the wooden wheels, and inflated. The front wheel, at least, still looks small. The question remains: would a 28-inch wheel and tyre fit? On my 26-inch Prince, the gap between the spoon brake and the tyre is much smaller.

I would be very interested to see a photo of the head decal on that Road Queen. Any photos of that bicycle would be welcome.

I finally have a deal in the works to acquire the Featherstone brochure from the Columbian Exposition.

6
I can’t imagine why, in the original discussion, there was any credence at all given to the idea that the wooden rims on the early Road Queen in question were original to that bicycle.

Now that the discussion has vanished from the internet, and the photos with it, it can not be determined how closely that Road Queen adhered to the cuts in your 1893 catalogue. I can say that my Prince is an absolutely perfect match for the cut in the 1893 catalogue of mid-range bicycles. It would also have been interesting to compare your catalogue illustrations to the photos of Paul Rubenson’s Road King.

Alas, Google have cached only the second page of the discussion:

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:z6rjOHvVUF0J:www.thewheelmen.org/forum/topic.asp%3FTOPIC_ID%3D8228%26whichpage%3D2+&cd=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

And the Internet Archive’s WayBack Machine has nothing at all from it.

That looks like a beautiful catalogue, by the way.

The seller of the Columbian Exposition brochure contacted the buyer on my behalf, though unfortunately, the latter declined to part with it. I have made a standing offer. And the seller, an expert on the Fair, very kindly supplied me with a superb high-resolution scan of the engraving of the Featherstone exhibit.

7
That’s quite a remarkable find!

It’s a shame that the treasure trove of commentary from the old Wheelmen forum was neither left up as an archive, nor merged onto the new forum. It would have been fascinating to compare the Road Queen and Road King on the lengthy Featherstone discussions with the illustrations and descriptions in that catalogue.

Does this catalogue feature other Featherstone models, or is it devoted solely to the Road King and Road Queen? (Readers should note that in 1893, Featherstone also issued a catalogue covering all models other than the King and Queen.) The 1894 and 1895 annual catalogues feature all models.

8
I wonder if any member here was the purchaser of the Featherstone brochure from the 1893 World’s Fair and Columbian Exposition, that was recently sold on eBay:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Featherstone-Bicycle-Exhibit-Fold-Ad-from-the-1893-World-039-s-Columbian-Exposition-/202694113141?hash=item2f3182b775%3Ag%3A3ZYAAOSwfF5c8Dir&nma=true&si=DucG4QrYT5COCyn6qrQIuQ9iqpU%253D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

I own a Featherstone Prince bicycle, recently restored by Craig Allen, that was a display model from the Fair. I would gladly pay a substantially higher price for the brochure, so as to be able to display it with the bicycle. Even high resolution scans would be helpful.

Any help would be most appreciated.


9
Ed, I hope that you’ll post some photographs of your Featherstone lady’s bicycle when the work is finished. There were some marvellous discussions of Featherstone history on the old Wheelmen forums.

(There must be some way to incorporate that treasure trove of information into this new forum, or to put up the old forum as an archive.)

Featherstone played a key rôle in the transition to pneumatic bicycle tyres, and introduced Dunlop tyres in the United States.

By the way, Craig fabricated the coaster pegs, exactly replicating the original style, and re-formed and re-configured the mudguards, making all of the fittings and brackets. And I think that the Garford saddle turned out magnificently.

10
Several years ago, I purchased an 1893 Featherstone Prince pneumatic tyre safety bicycle. This is a juvenile model with 26-inch wheels. It was missing the mudguards and coaster pegs; and the tyres, seat leather, and chain were not original. But the bicycle was otherwise complete and in original condition, albeit with most of the nickel plating, and much of the Japan finish, lost, and a fair amount of pitting on some sections.

The bicycle was not listed as a Featherstone, because instead of a maker’s decal as usual for that firm at that time, there was a nickel-plated shield-shaped badge stating, simply, “PRINCE”. When I purchased the bicycle, I was fairly sure that it was a Featherstone product, based on the excellent bicycle brand and model cross-reference here on the Wheelmen web-site.

In 2016, I searched through 1893 bicycle journals on Archive.Org, and found advertisements from Featherstone showing their different sized bicycles—(in falling order of size) Duke, Duchess, Road King, Road Queen, Prince, Princess, Baron, Baroness, Royal Middy, and Flying Jib. The illustration of the Prince looked extremely similar to my bicycle, but not exactly the same. I then noted that both the Prince and Baron were depicted by the same illustration, so it was clearly wrong for one of the models.

With the help of the late, and greatly missed, Wheelmen librarian Ross Hill, I obtained a PDF of the 1893 Featherstone catalogue covering all models except for the Road King and Queen, which they considered their premium models and worthy of a separate catalogue. The illustration of the Prince was identical to my bicycle, so I now had a definitive identification. I later obtained an original copy of the catalogue.

The presence of the “PRINCE” shield, instead of a decal with the maker’s name, remained a puzzle. I found that Featherstone, who had recently introduced Dunlop pneumatic tyres in the U.S., were one of a few bicycle manufacturers who had exhibits at the 1893 World’s Fair and Columbian Exposition in Chicago, where Featherstone were also located. In a contemporary article on the bicycle displays, the Featherstone exhibit was described as showing the entire “royal family”. I conjecture that my Prince was one of these show bicycles, and that all of their show bicycles had the shields instead of the decals. It would have been unnecessary for the maker’s name to be on these bicycles, because they were all part of the Featherstone exhibit.

I asked Craig Allen, a Wheelman, and widely considered the finest bicycle restorer in the U.S., if he would take on the restoration of the Prince. He agreed, and I shipped the bicycle to him. When he received it, he actually encouraged me to forego restoration, and instead preserve the bicycle by cleaning and the application of a product like Waxoyl, in the manner adopted by some collectors and riders. But I wanted the Prince restored to its former glory, and that is exactly what Craig did, to perfection. As I requested, he reinstalled as many original parts as possible, and he was able to save most of the spokes, which I found remarkable.

To say that I am delighted with Craig’s lovely restoration would be an understatement. He’s a magician, and has brought the Prince back to life!

Here are some photographs (taken under less than ideal conditions), headed by the cut from the 1893 Featherstone catalogue:

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General discussions on Wheelmen topics. / Re: 1900 London trolley ride
« on: December 03, 2018, 06:23:18 AM »
That’s superb! Thank you. The cycle ahead of the trolley, starting at about 3:08, appears to be fitted with a coaster brake hub.

I also noted the boy walking his cycle at 3:36. Perhaps he’d had a puncture?

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General discussions on Wheelmen topics. / Re: Sloping top tube
« on: November 10, 2018, 05:37:58 AM »
I think that Paul is on the right track. Also, the early diamond frame, with the sloping top tube, enabled a single frame size to fit more riders, by adjustment of the seat tube. As “scorching”—riding as fast as possible—became the craze, making the racing riding position popular, the horizontal top tube made a better aesthetic, and perhaps functional, fit.

Interestingly, although the diamond frame with horizontal top tube was dominant from 1895 to recent times, during the past twenty years, the sloping top tube has again become popular, sometimes even combined with the short wheelbase that was typical of the early 1890s.

In 2016, I purchased a Priority bicycle for every-day riding, and it is remarkable how much it resembles an early safety, especially once I added the “hairpin” saddle and lamp bracket. Note the similarity of its geometry to the 1893 Featherstone Prince that is with Craig Allen for restoration.





13
Although it is splendid to see that there is again a functional Wheelmen forum, I must ask what will become of the many years’ worth of extremely valuable discussions on the old forum? Surely they can at least be put up as an archive for reference, even if the content can not be merged into this new forum.

I hope that this will be given some consideration.

Users of the old forum should note that they will have to re-register for this new forum.

Also, one must now enter “captcha” verification letters when registering, and when posting messages. The letters in these particular images are quite difficult to discern, but one can click a link to hear the letters stated by a computerised voice.


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